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#3783202 - 04/25/12 06:27 PM Re: Social Security Fund to Run Out in '35 [Re: Feral]
dblboggie Offline
Urban Myth

Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 49001
Loc: Nowhere... I'm a Myth!
Originally Posted By: Feral
And just for the record...
Originally Posted By: Chickfan
Romney would be a great President

rofl


Compared with the President he'd replace, Gomer Pyle, hell... his cousin Goober, would look like a great President... Romney couldn't be too far behind that. giggle
_________________________

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#3783205 - 04/25/12 06:29 PM Re: Social Security Fund to Run Out in '35 [Re: Feral]
TexasBlue Offline
Monitor Tanned

Registered: 02/03/05
Posts: 5142
Loc: Minnesota
There is no fixing SSA, Medicare or Medicaid..... until the system finally crashes.

No fixing it because neither party has the balls to do it. The Dems won't do it because they rely on the votes of the elderly and the poor. The GOP won't do it because they already don't get many votes from the poor. Take away the cash cow and that'll do it for them. The class warfare that the DNC has been pushing for the last couple of decades has worked brilliantly.

When you get gov't benefits, you keep voting for those who keep promising to give them to you. Works every time. But the day that the system takes a shit, everyone will be fucked.
_________________________
Visit Superior Politics

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#3783241 - 04/25/12 06:47 PM Re: Social Security Fund to Run Out in '35 [Re: TexasBlue]
Feral Offline
Taoiseach den fhoirm baineann

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 2121
Loc: Wandering, but not lost
Originally Posted By: TexasBlue
There is no fixing SSA, Medicare or Medicaid..... until the system finally crashes.

No fixing it because neither party has the balls to do it. The Dems won't do it because they rely on the votes of the elderly and the poor. The GOP won't do it because they already don't get many votes from the poor. Take away the cash cow and that'll do it for them. The class warfare that the DNC has been pushing for the last couple of decades has worked brilliantly.

When you get gov't benefits, you keep voting for those who keep promising to give them to you. Works every time. But the day that the system takes a shit, everyone will be fucked.

I think the problem most people have is seeing it beyond a single event. Most upheaval doesn't happen in a day. It goes for years, like a plateau with a steep side, and I think we are seeing that edge now.
So, what do you do? In all major change - rebellion, revolution, civil war, what have you - multiple groups tend to vie for power. What do you do to deny them and revert, or convert, this particular country back to its roots?

Top
#3783336 - 04/25/12 07:28 PM Re: Social Security Fund to Run Out in '35 [Re: Feral]
ChickFan Offline
Hot Prospect

Registered: 02/17/12
Posts: 243
Originally Posted By: Feral
how would you enact these, or any other ideas for that matter?

Start with #1 and #4 on my list. Tomorrow.

Those new to the Congress job will listen to their constituents, those seeking the jobs from term-limit ousters, must satisfy their voting public. No more lifetime Congressmen.

Also, no lifetime pensions or medical for these guys.
Then, when they are no longer Congressmen, let them go buy and pay through the nose for private medical and see how F**ked up it is firsthand. Let them buy their own gas when they are out of office. Let them deal with medical company phone trees and billings. let them go get a job without the perks...then and only then will we see reform bills that make sense passed by Congresspeople who cherish the responsibility and duty to America.
_________________________
Avatar is Kelly Clarkson

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#3783376 - 04/25/12 07:54 PM Re: Social Security Fund to Run Out in '35 [Re: ChickFan]
Feral Offline
Taoiseach den fhoirm baineann

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 2121
Loc: Wandering, but not lost
Originally Posted By: ChickFan
Originally Posted By: Feral
how would you enact these, or any other ideas for that matter?

Start with #1 and #4 on my list. Tomorrow.

Those new to the Congress job will listen to their constituents, those seeking the jobs from term-limit ousters, must satisfy their voting public. No more lifetime Congressmen.

Also, no lifetime pensions or medical for these guys.
Then, when they are no longer Congressmen, let them go buy and pay through the nose for private medical and see how F**ked up it is firsthand. Let them buy their own gas when they are out of office. Let them deal with medical company phone trees and billings. let them go get a job without the perks...then and only then will we see reform bills that make sense passed by Congresspeople who cherish the responsibility and duty to America.

You managed to break my only condition on the question.
Again, your solution entails assumptions that a) elections haven't been hopelessly corrupted, b) that you can elect a veto-overriding majority of representatives that c) are willing to forego their newfound power in order to limit said power. Can you think of one government, anywhere, at any time in history, that has willingly given up any power?
And you say "Tomorrow", as if any of this could happen suddenly, or even within the span of a given election cycle.

While we're on fantasy, I'd also like to hear your take on the population issue. Hypothetically, if tomorrow you ruled the world, what would you do?

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#3783379 - 04/25/12 07:56 PM Re: Social Security Fund to Run Out in '35 [Re: Feral]
dblboggie Offline
Urban Myth

Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 49001
Loc: Nowhere... I'm a Myth!
Originally Posted By: Feral
Originally Posted By: TexasBlue
There is no fixing SSA, Medicare or Medicaid..... until the system finally crashes.

No fixing it because neither party has the balls to do it. The Dems won't do it because they rely on the votes of the elderly and the poor. The GOP won't do it because they already don't get many votes from the poor. Take away the cash cow and that'll do it for them. The class warfare that the DNC has been pushing for the last couple of decades has worked brilliantly.

When you get gov't benefits, you keep voting for those who keep promising to give them to you. Works every time. But the day that the system takes a shit, everyone will be fucked.

I think the problem most people have is seeing it beyond a single event. Most upheaval doesn't happen in a day. It goes for years, like a plateau with a steep side, and I think we are seeing that edge now.
So, what do you do In all major change - rebellion, revolution, civil war, what have you - multiple groups tend to vie for power. What do you do to deny them and revert, or convert, this particular country back to its roots


What we'd need to do is duplicate the conditions of our founding. That would not just mean having a core group highly intelligent and freedom loving classical liberals in key leadership positions, but we'd have to have a population that just wanted to left alone by the federal government and to make their own way.

While we could easily muster the leadership, a century of leftist indoctrination at large and at least four decades of indoctrination via our government schools on the virtues of big government as surrogate parent to the masses makes duplicating the population of our founding impossible.

That's a rather inartful way of stating it, but I trust you take my point.

Nearly half of all taxpayers are receiving transfer payments from the government. Far from seeking freedom from government interference in our lives, these people (like those of the "Occupy" movement) are seeking a government with even greater redistributionist powers than it has now.

Far too many Americans are just too ignorant of the basics necessary to be a responsible citizen. They know little to nothing about our history, our political system, our founding documents, the great thinkers who so influenced the creation of those documents, basic economics, and the list goes on.

Even if by some miracle we managed to restore our Republic to its true roots, how long could that possibly last with a population as poorly educated (or more accurately as purposely mis-educated) as ours is today?
_________________________

Top
#3783580 - 04/25/12 09:55 PM Re: Social Security Fund to Run Out in '35 [Re: Feral]
ChickFan Offline
Hot Prospect

Registered: 02/17/12
Posts: 243
Feral,

my list started with this:

"The solutions are simple, but will NEVER happen."

no way, no chance, no how, no dice.

Thanks for asking, but overpopulation is a problem.
and as Forest Gump said.."that's all I have to say about that"
_________________________
Avatar is Kelly Clarkson

Top
#3783640 - 04/25/12 10:12 PM Re: Social Security Fund to Run Out in '35 [Re: dblboggie]
Feral Offline
Taoiseach den fhoirm baineann

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 2121
Loc: Wandering, but not lost
Originally Posted By: dblboggie
Originally Posted By: Feral
Originally Posted By: TexasBlue
There is no fixing SSA, Medicare or Medicaid..... until the system finally crashes.

No fixing it because neither party has the balls to do it. The Dems won't do it because they rely on the votes of the elderly and the poor. The GOP won't do it because they already don't get many votes from the poor. Take away the cash cow and that'll do it for them. The class warfare that the DNC has been pushing for the last couple of decades has worked brilliantly.

When you get gov't benefits, you keep voting for those who keep promising to give them to you. Works every time. But the day that the system takes a shit, everyone will be fucked.

I think the problem most people have is seeing it beyond a single event. Most upheaval doesn't happen in a day. It goes for years, like a plateau with a steep side, and I think we are seeing that edge now.
So, what do you do In all major change - rebellion, revolution, civil war, what have you - multiple groups tend to vie for power. What do you do to deny them and revert, or convert, this particular country back to its roots


What we'd need to do is duplicate the conditions of our founding. That would not just mean having a core group highly intelligent and freedom loving classical liberals in key leadership positions, but we'd have to have a population that just wanted to left alone by the federal government and to make their own way.

While we could easily muster the leadership, a century of leftist indoctrination at large and at least four decades of indoctrination via our government schools on the virtues of big government as surrogate parent to the masses makes duplicating the population of our founding impossible.

That's a rather inartful way of stating it, but I trust you take my point.

Nearly half of all taxpayers are receiving transfer payments from the government. Far from seeking freedom from government interference in our lives, these people (like those of the "Occupy" movement) are seeking a government with even greater redistributionist powers than it has now.

Far too many Americans are just too ignorant of the basics necessary to be a responsible citizen. They know little to nothing about our history, our political system, our founding documents, the great thinkers who so influenced the creation of those documents, basic economics, and the list goes on.

Even if by some miracle we managed to restore our Republic to its true roots, how long could that possibly last with a population as poorly educated (or more accurately as purposely mis-educated) as ours is today?

What other safeguards could be taken? For example, if you were to create a new Bill of Rights, what would you include?
_________________________


I am the rock on the eternal shore
Crash against me and be broken



Top
#3783651 - 04/25/12 10:15 PM Re: Social Security Fund to Run Out in '35 [Re: ChickFan]
Feral Offline
Taoiseach den fhoirm baineann

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 2121
Loc: Wandering, but not lost
Originally Posted By: ChickFan
Feral,

my list started with this:

"The solutions are simple, but will NEVER happen."

no way, no chance, no how, no dice.

Thanks for asking, but overpopulation is a problem.
and as Forest Gump said.."that's all I have to say about that"

I know, you did say never.
As for the second...I'd really like to hear your thoughts. Why say something is a problem if you don't have a solution?
I'm getting the feeling that you do, but perhaps are wary of sharing for fear of attack. If that's the case, then PM it to me.
No judgement.

Top
#3784077 - 04/25/12 11:34 PM Re: Social Security Fund to Run Out in '35 [Re: Feral]
dblboggie Offline
Urban Myth

Registered: 01/26/05
Posts: 49001
Loc: Nowhere... I'm a Myth!
Originally Posted By: Feral
Originally Posted By: dblboggie
Originally Posted By: Feral
Originally Posted By: TexasBlue
There is no fixing SSA, Medicare or Medicaid..... until the system finally crashes.

No fixing it because neither party has the balls to do it. The Dems won't do it because they rely on the votes of the elderly and the poor. The GOP won't do it because they already don't get many votes from the poor. Take away the cash cow and that'll do it for them. The class warfare that the DNC has been pushing for the last couple of decades has worked brilliantly.

When you get gov't benefits, you keep voting for those who keep promising to give them to you. Works every time. But the day that the system takes a shit, everyone will be fucked.

I think the problem most people have is seeing it beyond a single event. Most upheaval doesn't happen in a day. It goes for years, like a plateau with a steep side, and I think we are seeing that edge now.
So, what do you do In all major change - rebellion, revolution, civil war, what have you - multiple groups tend to vie for power. What do you do to deny them and revert, or convert, this particular country back to its roots


What we'd need to do is duplicate the conditions of our founding. That would not just mean having a core group highly intelligent and freedom loving classical liberals in key leadership positions, but we'd have to have a population that just wanted to left alone by the federal government and to make their own way.

While we could easily muster the leadership, a century of leftist indoctrination at large and at least four decades of indoctrination via our government schools on the virtues of big government as surrogate parent to the masses makes duplicating the population of our founding impossible.

That's a rather inartful way of stating it, but I trust you take my point.

Nearly half of all taxpayers are receiving transfer payments from the government. Far from seeking freedom from government interference in our lives, these people (like those of the "Occupy" movement) are seeking a government with even greater redistributionist powers than it has now.

Far too many Americans are just too ignorant of the basics necessary to be a responsible citizen. They know little to nothing about our history, our political system, our founding documents, the great thinkers who so influenced the creation of those documents, basic economics, and the list goes on.

Even if by some miracle we managed to restore our Republic to its true roots, how long could that possibly last with a population as poorly educated (or more accurately as purposely mis-educated) as ours is today

What other safeguards could be taken For example, if you were to create a new Bill of Rights, what would you include


The first question is excellent. The second, I don't think the Bill of Rights needs additions - clarification perhaps, but not additions.

I suppose if I were to consider a new constitution, I wouldn't alter the original one iota in intent. I would only write it in a manner which made it perfectly clear to contemporary readers the precise meaning and intent of the framers of that document. The Commerce Clause would recieve the bulk of my attention as it has been the most abused. After that the 1st and 2nd Amendmments would need clarification to correct current misunderstandings (I'm being very charitable with that characterization as I'm sure you know) about the intent of those rights.

I would also eliminate all Amendments past the 10th as our Constitution and it's foundational supporting document, the Declaration of Independence, make it very clear that ALL people (regardless of race or gender) are endowed with unalienable rights to life, liberty and property. Two of those later Amendments are most responsible for the erosion of our liberties, and those would be the 16th and 17th.

Of course all of this is academic; until the population at large has suffered enough pain due to our errant ways, they will never take the steps neecessary to return our republic to its intended form.

I fear we may never see a rejuvination of the spirit and intent of our constitution and a return our rightful liberties. It is more likely that we will go the way of the UK and Western Europe; a slow and painful decline into the same obscurity that Greece (once one of the greatest republics on earth) now enjoys.

But I yet hold on to a tiny flicker of hope that something like the Tea Party movement might yet take hold and morph into something that could snap enough of Americans out of their complacent stupor nad move us slowly in the right direction.

There is nothing in history that justifies that hope, but I hold onto it nonetheless.
_________________________

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