You haven't answered my questions. And if we are going to go there, I could argue that organized Mormonism has proven itself a greater threat to liberty and individual faith than any other religion state-side in recent memory.

What are you specifically asking feral? And how has mormonism proven to be greater threat to liberty and individual faith?

If you look at the early history of our church you will find that mormons were one of the most persecuted group of christians and the majority of thier persecutors were other christians...in particular the baptists.

And

I agree. Most minority groups, for whatever reason or purpose, have been persecuted.
But now, the tide has turned, and Utah is a theocracy in everything but name.

I am saying that the uniform objective of Judeo/Christian religions is to inculcate the practice of virtue by its adherents. That all adherents do not uniformly do so does not invalidate the objective.

Religion says to a population that there is something greater than the individual. It gives believers a reason to hold baser instincts in check and offers succor to those for whom the routine hardships of life would be unbearable without the hope it offers.

And even with republican government and the rule of law, human nature still manages to exert itself, but its influence is moderated somewhat by religion.

I can't understand why any of this would come as a surprise to any one familiar with the great sweep of history.

It seems that atheists, being largely prejudiced against all things religious, take an extremely narrow and biased view of history and miss or discount the favorable influences as they view religious belief with scorn and as a sign of weakness and intellectual inferiority.

Never mind that some history's greatest scientists and thinkers have been religious, even prfoundly religious; and some the greatest discoveries of science have been made by religious scientists.

It was Catholic priests, monks, bishops, cardinals and even popes that rescued many of the truly importants writings and art of classic Greece and Rome.

Sure, there have been plenty of atrocities committed by man in the name of religion, after all, no institution of man is without its flaws, but there have been countless acts of charity by the church throughout its history.

I guess I'm just one of those unbelievers that doesn't take such a narrow view of history or who holds religion and the religious in contempt.

I have a thorough (and never ending) study of history to thank for that.

Virtue in almost all religions, even if aligned, is defined differently. And while that may be an objective, it may also be incidental.

Case in point. Possibly the primary objective. But the French and Italians might say, "As does fine dining."

I fail to see this moderation of human nature. The State apparatus as it exists today, particularly in the U.S., has allowed to occur the industrialization of immorality. And I say that in the most specific sense possible; theft, rape, and murder. What I'd normally hesitate to call it, evil.
I don't quite understand the point of this statement; it is almost as if you assume no one here knows anything but you.
This is a fierce and typically shoddy generalization that I have seen many times before. I have met quite a few atheists, and while it is true that some of their beliefs approach that of religious dogma and fervor, it is not true of all or even most of them.
Again, I need clarification. Do you equate a belief in God as religious? Or is it that they identify with a religion?

Agreed.

That remains to be seen.

Finally! You've noticed! Congratulations.

You troll by posts of endless questions which, no matter how many times they are answered, never seem to end.

You take no positions, you answer no questions put to you, and you ceaselessly quibble over the definitions of words.

You generate a ridiculous amount of copy without saying a single thing or taking any position.

I refuse to answer even one more of your endless questions.

I repeatedly asked you to answer several questions I put to you weeks ago, and you even promised to do so, even said you had already written it, if I but answered just one question, which I did. It was followed by no answers to my questions by you.

You are just another troll.

Expect that I will not be answering any of your endless stream of inane questions.

I leave that for suckers who think you are actually possessed of something intelligent to say or contribute.

Not to derail this thread by discussing the initial post, but I must have spent 10 minutes trying to figure out the effective purpose of the metal collar that the slave was wearing. It seems pretty impractical.

I was just thinking that while perusing the entire thread...I think it's like a dog pole, with the noose at the end. Keeps them at arm's length if they try to attack, while being readily graspable if they try to flee.
Great for bad dogs AND slaves!

^^ Thanks. That makes sense. It had me dumbfounded.

No, I mean you appear to be referring to a post I made, but your statement doesn't contradict mine.

Making an assumption, of course, that your intent was to rebut in some way what I said, but feel free to correct me.