Ah then you prefer a god who would force us to do his will..not unlike the offer Lucifer presented to the Grand Council in Heaven in the preexistence...to become our savior by making sure everyone returns to the Father even if he had to rob everyone of thier free will to accomplish it.
Had God robbed us of free will he would have stopped us from causing all these wars of our own making, he would have made us into living robots.
But we are not living robots. We are beings of free will to choose for ourselves...to choose good or to choose evil...to heed God or to reject God and heed the devil.
I don't prefer any god. I don't believe in gods, deities, leprachauns or big foot.
A valid point was made about the pharoah. God "hardened" his heart and then punished him and thousands of innocents for having a hardened heart.
What a loving fella.
_________________________
"Yes.. Men like sports.. Men watch the action movie.. they eat of the beef and enjoy to look at the busoms." - Xander Harris
"Have you accepted Jesus Christ as your personal savior??" "Ya know.. I meant to but then I got really busy"
Ah then you prefer a god who would force us to do his will..not unlike the offer Lucifer presented to the Grand Council in Heaven in the preexistence...to become our savior by making sure everyone returns to the Father even if he had to rob everyone of thier free will to accomplish it.
Had God robbed us of free will he would have stopped us from causing all these wars of our own making, he would have made us into living robots.
But we are not living robots. We are beings of free will to choose for ourselves...to choose good or to choose evil...to heed God or to reject God and heed the devil.
I don't prefer any god. I don't believe in gods, deities, leprachauns or big foot.
A valid point was made about the pharoah. God "hardened" his heart and then punished him and thousands of innocents for having a hardened heart.
What a loving fella.
Does that apply to breaking rules and laws that don't jive with your mindset? Do you think it is fine to jay walk in the middle of a busy intersection or cutting someone off just so you can beat the lights and not face the penalty?
Fine believe what you will gumby...
As for Pharoah all he had to do was simply let the hebrew people go and Egypt would not have had to endure the plagues.
He refused....
Pharoah was the ruler of ancient Egypt and his kingdom and his people were his responsibity..the responsibilty of the deaths and suffering of his people even his own son were upon his own head.
_________________________
To one who has faith, no explanation is necessary. To one without faith, no explanation is possible". ~Thomas Aquinas
#3680414 - 02/17/1201:09 PMRe: To understand the things of God you need the Spirit of God and that requires some faith
[Re: 1oldminer]
nblsavage
Established Member
Registered: 08/31/04
Posts: 750
Originally Posted By: 1oldminer
As for Pharoah all he had to do was simply let the hebrew people go and Egypt would not have had to endure the plagues.
He refused....
You're either incredibly dense or simply dishonest. How could Pharaoh comply when God was interfering with his free will? God turned him into a puppet when he hardened his heart.
As for Pharoah all he had to do was simply let the hebrew people go and Egypt would not have had to endure the plagues.
He refused....
You're either incredibly dense or simply dishonest. How could Pharaoh comply when God was interfering with his free will? God turned him into a puppet when he hardened his heart.
No sir..I'm afraid you are the one who is actually dense and dishonest...I would not be able to make it anymore simpler to you on the concept of agency and accountability because you have hardened your own heart and thus are not willing to listen to or even try to understand the things of God. Nor do you comprehend nor accept personal accountabilty and responsibity of a given individual's actions.
I don't think I can add anything that might soften your heart that will have to be up to you..hopefully you will figure it out someday for your sake...
I wish you well.
_________________________
To one who has faith, no explanation is necessary. To one without faith, no explanation is possible". ~Thomas Aquinas
I accept the Bible as the standard of holy scripture...
What does that mean exactly? If you believe that the Bible is "the standard of holy scripture", then you should heed what it says in Revelation 22 and not add to it or take away from it and also Galatians 1:6-9 which says not to preach any gospel other than what the Apostle Paul preached.
_________________________
I believe that if you wheel in an oxygen canister and a hydrogen canister and open the valves and then sprinkle some carbon around and a little bit of this and a little bit of that and put a little moisture in the air and add a sun lamp, then when you come back in 5 billion years the carbon, hydrogen and oxygen atoms will have assembled themselves into human beings.
Jeez.. I mean I guess one has to have a certain measure of self imposed ignorance to buy into the whole magic underwear cult..
but to flat out ignore "GOD hardened his heart" even though it's been pointed out many times.. is just plain dopey
If God occasionally hardens peoples' hearts after they have already repeatedly disobeyed Him, does that mean that He always controls our every action and decision? No. He lets us make our own decisions.
Deuteronomy 30:19
19I call heaven and earth to witness this day against you that I have set before you life and death, the blessings and the curses; therefore choose life, that you and your descendants may live
_________________________
I believe that if you wheel in an oxygen canister and a hydrogen canister and open the valves and then sprinkle some carbon around and a little bit of this and a little bit of that and put a little moisture in the air and add a sun lamp, then when you come back in 5 billion years the carbon, hydrogen and oxygen atoms will have assembled themselves into human beings.
Previous Topic
Index
